George Unregistered User (5/25/00 12:21:31 pm) Reply Midwest Prog I am at the end of my third year and have just recently decided to pursue Orthopedics. I am wondering which programs in the midwest will take my application seriously. I am not a numerical superstar, but my board scores are in the 220's. I do have research experience but not in orthopedics. I know that I probably will not be seriously considered by the elite programs, but which in the midwest are realistic for me? Bob Local user (5/26/00 9:46:20 am) Reply Re: Midwest Prog Well, if the rest of your academic performance is solid, I think that you could be a competitive candidate. My best advice would be to find a couple of programs that you like, and are realistic, and do rotations there. If you fit in well, this can be a huge boost for your application. Also, apply to any program that you think you may like - you never know what may happen. As far as programs go, some that may consider your application could include (of course, I'm kinda guessing here).......... Wayne State University (Detroit, MI)(solid program with lots of trauma) Loyola in Chicago SUMMA in Akron, OH (I really liked this community program) Akron General in OH Medical College of Ohio in Toledo I think there is one in Ft. Wayne, IN I'm sure there are others, but these come to mind off the top of my head. Hope these suggestions help, and good luck. orthochief Unregistered User (5/30/00 9:08:58 pm) Reply stop the self-mutilation George, if your numbers are what you say they are consider yourself a competitive candidate now. I agree with the roatation suggestion. It is a way to really leave a good(or bad) impression with a program. I know you would make that first cut (avoid the wastebasket with your numbers)at my program. I am at one of the bigger programs in the Midwest. You should look at places like Loyola, Grand Rapids, Ohio State, Wisconsin, Cincinnati, Minnesota, Mayo etc. Good Luck George Unregistered User (5/31/00 12:29:22 pm) Reply Midwest Programs Thanks Orthochief, I am planning on doing away rotations at Loyola Univ. and Ohio State. My interest is to end up in Ohio or in the Chicagoland area. Thanks for information. I am also looking seriously at U of Minn. and U of Louisville because of family and friends in these two cities. One last thing, do you think that taking boards early is a good idea? is November too late? Orthochief Unregistered User (5/31/00 8:05:40 pm) Reply Midwest programs I really dont think that part 2 matters that much in the grand scheme of things. When you go to interview, not all people have taken part 2, some take it in the spring. If you want to get it out of the way then do it early, otherwise dont sweat it and take it in the spring. Good call on Ohio State. Buckeye Unregistered User (6/3/00 5:51:33 am) Reply Ohio State What's up George. I am a 3rd year med student at Ohio State and am Ortho bound myself, so I thought I'd give you my opinion of my home institution. THE GOOD: I have met all of the current interns and a few of the other residents and those I've met are all really laid back and fun people to work with. The department seems to be moving in a good direction with the appointment of Dr. Mallory to the chair. The OSUMC just took over a failing Med Center in the downtown vicinity and are moving towards using it in part as a dedicated Ortho research and clinical facility. THE BAD: The department of Surgery is malignant as hell!! The interns I've met were while on my Gen. Surg. rotation and I have pretty good insight as to what malignancy means. These guys certainly had a rough go of intern year, one guy dropped the program!! To be honest I have not talked to this individual about why he dropped, but my personal feeling is that it had to do with the intern year work load. I certainly would not expect any intern year to be sunshine and daydreams, but I think that institutions with know malignant programs will have it a bit rougher! As far as Columbus and vicinity.... I'm from San Diego and I equate living in Ohio to... Well let's just say it's not what I consider optimal. George Unregistered User (6/3/00 8:53:48 am) Reply OSU Buckeye, Thanks for the info. Is the program shifting to having the ortho residents under the orthopaedics department umbrella? A lot of programs are going to this format which decreases the amount of general surgery an ortho resident has to fulfill. George orthochief Unregistered User (6/3/00 8:17:39 pm) Reply Go Bucks The intern year at osu is now under the control of our department as of July 1. It is much more benign than what was described above. Kent Unregistered User (6/4/00 1:51:21 pm) Reply Minnesota program I'm a graduate of the U of Minnesota medical school and just matched in orthopaedic surgery at the University of Missouri-Columbia (I'm originally from Missouri). Minesota's program is a really good one and I would have ranked it first except for the fact that I received both my granduate degree and medical degree from Minnesota (and thought it would be best to train at a new place, new area, new people, etc.). They take 6 residents each year and require a "Minnesota Statement" in the personal statement section of the application. Basically, it's just a short statement of why you are specifically applying to Minnesota (and not just because the trend is to file a butt-load of applications and shotgun the nation). The program is solid in every discipline (kinda weak in ankle/foot, but who cares...you're not a podiatrist). They have several clinical sites from county hospitals (Hennepin Co--great for trauma), private (Abbott Northwestern), University (Fairview-University---lots of weird complicated stuff), pediatric (Gillette and the Shriner's Hospital), and the nicest VA in the nation (fairly new, lots of autonomy early in the residency years). All the areas are covered, from adult reconstructive, tumor, spine, peds, trauma, sports, elective and weird stuff. The chairman is Dr. Marc Swiontkowski (one of the demigods in trauma) who came here a few years ago from Harborview in Seattle, WA. Yes, the weather (especially winter) can blow big time, but all in all, it's a great place to live and a great program. Check it out! As far as Mayo, they are a big class (10 residents each year). The gripe I've always heard about Mayo is that you graduate at the end of five years and can't operate worth a damn because the fellows take all the good cases. So, you've got this great brand name (Mayo) and you'll get any fellowship you want, but you MUST do a fellowship so you can learn to operate! Rochester, MN is also a small place and gets the same rough winter weather at the Twin Cities. If you're interested in other Midwest programs, consider the University of Missouri-Columbia. Now granted I've haven't actually started there yet, but I ranked it first because I got a great vibe from the program. It's small (just 3 residents and one of them does a year of research after the intern year) and the staff is small (about 7- , but that kind of size lets you work one-on-one with your staff, is great for follow-up, and keeps you from getting lost in the crowd. They have the University hospital and a VA (you really cheat yourself of some excellent experience if you go to a program without a VA) located conveniently across the street from each other. There's lots of blunt trauma (the good kind for orthopaedics, not that gun-and-kinfe crap) from MVA, recreational (Missouri has huge lakes) and farming. They fly two helicopters and have a very large catchment. Columbia is a quintessential college town of about 80,000 and is usually ranked very high on those "best places to live" lists. Other Midwest programs to consider are the University of Oklahoma (great clinical experience, but Ok City's kinda a boring place) and the University of Kansas-Wichita. The University of Iowa is a great program, but tough to get a spot. slk Local user (6/4/00 6:12:37 pm) Reply Cleveland Clinic Kent, what have you heard about the Cleveland Clinic? I have heard bits and pieces, just generally that it's a good program and real tough to get, but do you know any specifics? thanks.. Kent Unregistered User (6/5/00 11:15:06 am) Reply Cleveland Clinic I don't know if I can add much to what you already know. It's an excellent program, one of the larger ones I believe (I've tossed my literature from them), also has research opportunities (an additional year, I believe) and is hard to get into (aren't they all?) I actually didn't send my ERAS application to them because the literature I received strongly hinted that they mostly take people who have done avway rotations at CC. I guess I appreciated their honesty and upfrontness. The message was something like..."we strongly encourage visiting electives at our program. In fact, 8 of the last 10 (or some such set of numbers ) residents selected had done rotations at CC". I don't know if they are counting their own students as having done rotations there. It kinda sounded like non-CC students that were selected had mostly done away rotations. Anyway, not every resident had rotated at CC, but it certainly sounds like it helps your chances greatly. Ortho Guy Unregistered User (6/5/00 12:44:58 pm) Reply Re: Cleveland Clinic CCF is a great program. It takes four residents per year, although their caseload could support more. They just got a new chairman, Joseph Ianotti, who will make the program even better. He is a big resident advocate. They are considering adding a year of research for two of the four residents (similar to Pitt's, which is also a great program), but this hasn't been decided yet. Their staff is among the best in the world. All areas of orthopaedics are represented by world renowned surgeons. There are a good number of fellows there, but they don't interfere with the resident education. Each resident works one on one with an attending for a couple of months (like Mayo). The residents get to do a lot of operating and are very happy there. Approximately 60% of the residents had rotated there prior to matching. I would say that rotating there definetly helps if you are a strong candidate (and you make a good impression). bdocgeorge Unregistered User (6/5/00 9:17:20 pm) Reply Brutus Orthochief, Who would you recommend I work with at OSU this fall? bdoc orthochief Unregistered User (6/7/00 7:17:30 am) Reply go bucks Dr. Mallory =================================